Queues:ViewChatLog

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chatLog: cost/day(4), owner(llsl=Rex-Cronon), create(09/25/2018@12:27:11), expire(12/01/18 @ 12:27:11), public(yes), max(1200), delete(10), send(PRIVATE), data{linesNow(299), linesTotal(299)}
Total number of lines: 299
  1. T[2018-11-13T20:01:10.734115Z] Started: <212.00000, 44.00000, 109.91040>{Denby}
  2. A[20:01:14] Rex Cronon: .
  3. T[20:01:33] Moved: <212.00000, 44.00000, 32.95587>{Denby}
  4. A[20:01:49] Jenna Felton: Meeter forgot to switch to saving time :)
  5. A[20:01:49] Rex Cronon: hello everybody
  6. A[20:01:56] Jenna Felton: hello Simon and Rider
  7. A[20:02:05] Jenna Felton: and Rex :)
  8. A[20:02:13] Rider Linden: Hello there
  9. A[20:02:16] Simon Linden: Hello everyone
  10. A[20:02:21] animats Resident: So did the world. Notice that it's daylight here.
  11. A[20:02:33] Rex Cronon: hi jenna:)
  12. A[20:02:36] Rex Cronon: hi rider
  13. A[20:02:40] Rex Cronon: hi simon
  14. A[20:02:44] Simon Linden: Let's see ... server news
  15. A[20:03:17] Simon Linden: We updated the main channel servers this morning, so now almost everything is on the same version, aside from the few test EEP regions
  16. A[20:03:57] Simon Linden: I'm not sure what this weeks release notes said, TBH
  17. A[20:04:13] Whirly Fizzle: Without looking, probably "internal fixes" :P
  18. A[20:04:24] Mazidox Linden: There was some internal logging changes too!
  19. A[20:04:33] Whirly Fizzle: Whoohoo
  20. A[20:04:47] animats Resident: Did you put in logging to catch region crossing problems?
  21. A[20:04:50] Tyrehl Byk: The test EEP regions are now inworld?
  22. A[20:05:02] Simon Linden: There are test EEP regions on the main grid, yes
  23. A[20:05:15] Chaser Zaks: internal fixes are actually mirror construction but no one wants to admit it
  24. A[20:05:15] Rex Cronon: hi there. u feeling better mazidox?
  25. A[20:05:24] Simon Linden: I haven't worked on crossings Joe
  26. A[20:05:37] Rider Linden: Yes. Longfellow (on the other side of the river here) as well as Hippotropolis.
  27. A[20:05:41] Mazidox Linden: Great Rex, never better.
  28. A[20:06:11] Rider Linden: (among others)
  29. A[20:06:17] Tyrehl Byk: Approximately how soon will EEP have a full rollout please?
  30. A[20:06:18] Rex Cronon: u need to be in great shape to eat turkey;)
  31. A[20:06:19] Simon Linden: "internal fixes" might also be things that support new shiny features that have to get on the whole grid before we release the viewer
  32. A[20:06:36] animats Resident: Don't look behind you, but the SpatialOS people have 150 developers working on region crossings, US $300 million, and a partnership with Google.
  33. A[20:07:12] Simon Linden: They really goofed up if they designed a virtual world with region crossings, TBH
  34. A[20:07:20] Lucia Nightfire: heh
  35. A[20:07:46] Rex Cronon: with 300 mill they can afford one server per sim:)
  36. A[20:08:21] Lucia Nightfire: maybe they didn't mess up and chance VR
  37. A[20:08:27] Lucia Nightfire: *chase/chance
  38. A[20:08:31] Simon Linden: making a promise that moving from one simulated section to another without any visible glitch is a fool's errand, but then I'm jaded after 11 years of hearing how bad region crossings are and spending months and months making it better
  39. A[20:08:32] Inara Pey: Stepping back a mo...."We updated the main channel servers this morning, so now almost everything is on the same version" - does that mean no planned RC deployments tomorrow? No release thread on the forums...
  40. A[20:08:48] animats Resident: Look into it. They're trying to do it right. Seamless, and the region boundaries move to shrink regions if they get crowded, to provide more resources where needed.
  41. A[20:08:52] Simon Linden: There will be RC releases tomorrow, yes
  42. A[20:08:57] Simon Linden: All 3 are the same version
  43. A[20:09:23] Inara Pey: Ta for clarifying ...
  44. A[20:09:40] Rex Cronon: if all their users have 100mb per sec connection, it might work joe:)
  45. T[20:10:06] Moved: <212.01620, 43.96859, 32.96009>{Denby}
  46. A[20:10:09] Simon Linden: I'm sure someone could do better than SL's 15 year old design starting now
  47. T[20:10:10] Moved: <212.80340, 45.04084, 32.96009>{Denby}
  48. A[20:10:28] Lucia Nightfire: just like everyone does animations better than SL, heh
  49. T[20:10:34] Moved: <212.41700, 45.03839, 32.96009>{Denby}
  50. A[20:12:58] Simon Linden: anyway, that's all the news I have, so the table's open for any topics, questions or calm rants
  51. A[20:13:22] Lucia Nightfire: how soon before you wrap up OS work? heh
  52. A[20:14:53] Simon Linden: Just in time to start the next upgrade, at this rate
  53. A[20:15:10] Qie Niangao: Apropos nothing: Is two-factor authentication on the drawing board anywhere? (Is that a question for the Town Hall, or should we just save the time for other topics?)
  54. A[20:15:58] Kallista Destiny: Has any love be given to BUG-8974 Temp rez object are not rezzed in a timely manner
  55. A[20:16:15] Simon Linden: We've definitely discussed it Qie and it's on our long list of things to do. I can't guess when it might happen, however
  56. A[20:16:27] Mazidox Linden: If nothing else I tag random surfaces with 2FA-or-Bust in Sharpie Qie.
  57. A[20:16:56] Rex Cronon: even with 2factor authentication people can still get hacked...
  58. A[20:17:22] Kallista Destiny: Yes but it is MUCH more difficult
  59. A[20:17:23] animats Resident: There's some kind of attack underway, Beq Janus tells me. There's "firestormviewer.pro", with a fake download of Firestorm for Windows.
  60. T[20:17:32] Moved: <212.41340, 45.03493, 32.96009>{Denby}
  61. A[20:17:38] animats Resident: Hosted in Russia.
  62. A[20:17:50] Lucia Nightfire: there are always illegal tpv's disguised as FS
  63. A[20:18:01] Rex Cronon: from russia with love:)
  64. A[20:18:12] Lou Netizen: like many things, if people use it well 2FA can increase their security. But it also creates new points of failure, and if it is *not* used well…
  65. A[20:19:14] Simon Linden: Did anyone figure out what kind of evilness they put in the fake viewer?
  66. A[20:19:38] Rex Cronon: snoweden might have an idea;)
  67. A[20:19:40] Qie Niangao: (sorry, bad time to crash - twice... thanks for the replies)
  68. A[20:19:42] Chaser Zaks: I'll download it now and run it through IDA Pro.
  69. A[20:19:44] Whirly Fizzle: So far their Mac & Linux downloads point to our official downloads. The Windows download is infected but no idea with what.
  70. A[20:19:45] Oz Linden: Yes... it lights up the virus checkers
  71. A[20:20:09] animats Resident: I tried the Windows executable in a few virus checkers and go tnothing.
  72. A[20:20:57] Rex Cronon: it might just steal passwords and turn their computers into drones for ddos?
  73. A[20:21:11] Chaser Zaks: If anyone has a link to the download, please send it to me in a IM, I can't find the site.
  74. A[20:21:28] Kallista Destiny: Or just steal passwords and the spread pfishing
  75. A[20:21:42] Whirly Fizzle: SEnt Chaser
  76. A[20:21:43] Simon Linden: Those are two different things Rex but yeah - if you download and run a bad executable then pretty much everything is compromised
  77. A[20:21:45] animats Resident: www.phoenixviewer.pro
  78. A[20:22:07] Lucia Nightfire: not even opening that link, heh
  79. A[20:22:29] Whirly Fizzle: This is the IM that the fake FS accounts are sending out: https://i.imgur.com/6WhHDeT.png
  80. A[20:22:42] Kallista Destiny: Just seeing that (www required) tells me that they are not pros.
  81. A[20:22:54] Chaser Zaks: Oh, bad DNS settings
  82. A[20:23:07] Rex Cronon: just get low price used computer lucy and u can try any thing on it:)
  83. A[20:24:49] Kallista Destiny: Just have your reinstall disk handy
  84. A[20:25:20] Simon Linden: There is one thing I'd like to mention, and that today is the anniversary of a very special moment in Second Life history. November 13th is V2 Day. Nine years ago we released version 2 of the viewer, which many people mark as the beginning of the end of Second Life.
  85. A[20:25:22] Rex Cronon: reinstall disk not enough. some viruses can mess motherboard bios
  86. A[20:25:38] Lucia Nightfire: I'm surprised at the number of gullible dated accounts that still fall for those full perms sellers on mp...
  87. A[20:26:16] Lucia Nightfire: Kitten Punch Anniversary
  88. A[20:26:30] Lucia Nightfire: punch out a kitten today and celebrate
  89. A[20:26:41] Lucia Nightfire: do nto start with me
  90. A[20:26:53] Rex Cronon: well the first viewer 2 had kind of bad color scheme...
  91. A[20:26:57] Mazidox Linden: It's been nine years since I helped pass QA on the end of the world as we know it... Wow.
  92. A[20:26:57] Whirly Fizzle: https://imgur.com/a/Fsq5eSv :D
  93. T[20:27:50] Moved: <211.09660, 47.05325, 32.96009>{Denby}
  94. A[20:28:11] Mazidox Linden: (I feel fine)
  95. A[20:29:07] Simon Linden: I know the intentions of V2 were good ... the old SL viewer UI was a crazy mess of things patched on by engineers with no overall design
  96. A[20:29:26] Chaser Zaks: Oh, Mazidox, I'm not sure if I showed you this yet but you inspired me to do it last meeting https://crocuta.softhyena.com/requestforspecialpowersfailed.png
  97. A[20:29:39] Simon Linden: But personally I think they made the mistake of trying to meet a schedule date and not waiting until it was right
  98. A[20:29:46] Kallista Destiny: We all know what good intentions pave
  99. A[20:29:49] Lucia Nightfire: when LL's viewer finally gets multi partial inventory name search like FS, I won't be so hard on it
  100. A[20:30:08] Lucia Nightfire: @Simon, like Sansar going to Steam? heh
  101. A[20:30:10] Mazidox Linden: The way to cookies Kallista?
  102. A[20:30:36] Kallista Destiny: ummmm not quite that nice a place
  103. A[20:30:36] Simon Linden: lol nice Chaser
  104. A[20:30:43] Rex Cronon: if only the sl viewer was modular and u could dynamically load modules...
  105. A[20:30:57] Simon Linden: You're not going to get me to comment on Sansar ... I'm working on SL :)
  106. A[20:31:14] Lucia Nightfire: or load more than one pending name resolution without beign stuck at "Loading..." for the rest
  107. A[20:31:22] animats Resident: Fair enough. They have their own problems to deal with.
  108. A[20:31:37] Chaser Zaks: I'm nto going to talk about it but I just want to say sansar to make the thing go off again.
  109. A[20:31:38] Mazidox Linden: I can confirm that this is actually what happens Chaser.
  110. A[20:31:49] animats Resident: Oh, that's what does it.
  111. A[20:32:07] animats Resident: I was disappointed to find out that EEP does not have rain.
  112. A[20:32:09] Rex Cronon: people "love" to download 15gb or more of data for each sansar region:)
  113. A[20:32:35] Lucia Nightfire: at least they can do it faster not with the texture protocol change....
  114. A[20:32:49] Lucia Nightfire: its still a nightmare env to make changes to
  115. A[20:32:55] Chaser Zaks: I'm going to sacrifice a VM installing that fake viewer.
  116. A[20:32:56] Simon Linden: it would be really cool to have rain, but then we have to have exclusion volumes so it doesn't get inside the house. It would be awesome, but a bunch of work
  117. A[20:33:32] animats Resident: I realize that. There is rain with exclusion barriers on Marketplace, but you have a lot of setup.
  118. A[20:33:37] Lou Netizen: As soon as you make rain, people will want snow that accumulated.
  119. A[20:33:40] Chaser Zaks: Exclusion volumes would be great, they could also be used to cut out water or terrain.
  120. A[20:33:42] Mazidox Linden: Do you not just build with no roof so the rain gets in?
  121. A[20:33:46] Rider Linden: /me has seen invented umbrellas on the marketplace.
  122. A[20:34:16] Chaser Zaks: invisiprims 2.0
  123. A[20:34:18] Simon Linden: yeah I always get frustrated with the water that ends up in boats
  124. A[20:34:19] Lucia Nightfire: ^
  125. A[20:34:35] animats Resident: Ideally, you'd like rain to obey the physics model. But does the viewer even get the physics model?
  126. A[20:34:45] Rex Cronon: AFK...............................
  127. A[20:34:46] Rex Cronon: afk
  128. A[20:34:47] Lucia Nightfire: exclusion volume prims are just invisiprims afaik as they occlude alpha textures used in particles
  129. A[20:35:00] Lucia Nightfire: in SL that is
  130. A[20:35:05] Lucia Nightfire: unity its something else, heh
  131. A[20:35:16] Simon Linden: It doesn't Joe, at least not the full thing that models the region
  132. A[20:35:49] Simon Linden: There is some physics code on the viewer and TBH I'm not sure what it does. I know a bunch is for pathfinding settings
  133. A[20:36:13] animats Resident: Haven't looked at that part.
  134. A[20:36:17] Oz Linden: Display of the navmesh, and some parts of the mesh uploader
  135. A[20:36:39] Lucia Nightfire: if particles can be made to bounce off terrain, then it shouldn't be that hard making exclusion volumes
  136. A[20:36:53] Chaser Zaks: Rain can also be done via raycasting, not sure how slow it would be but it could be cached like particles do, so that you can create a rain particle and have it's death point be at a cached raycast point
  137. A[20:36:57] Lucia Nightfire: although bounce ignores particle size iirc
  138. A[20:38:31] Chaser Zaks: Is this the right UG to ask questions about mainland stuff(simulator side)?
  139. A[20:38:33] Oz Linden: Of course, it would be easier to do changes like that if we were close source the viewer, but that ship has sailed
  140. A[20:39:04] Oz Linden: Ask away, Chaser... we aren't shy about telling you we can't answer
  141. A[20:39:08] animats Resident: You'd need to staff up, then.
  142. A[20:39:10] Simon Linden: Sure Chaser, ask anything. I"m not sure you'll get an answer
  143. A[20:39:25] Lucia Nightfire: I think the % of users on tpv have spoken which env they prefer, heh
  144. A[20:39:31] Oz Linden: We always need to staff up, Joe :-)
  145. A[20:40:16] Chaser Zaks: Is there any possible way to acquire the original baked heightmaps(pristine before user modification, but post road design) of mainland? I'd like to acquire them for uses of generating some fancy maps that show height detail.
  146. A[20:41:33] Simon Linden: I think the short answer to that is "no"
  147. A[20:42:49] Beq Janus: hey all, sorry I'm late.
  148. A[20:42:55] Whirly Fizzle: Hey Beq
  149. A[20:42:56] Jenna Felton: hello Beq :)
  150. A[20:42:57] Oz Linden: Do you mean for the whole continent, or for some particular region, Chaser?
  151. A[20:43:41] Chaser Zaks: Whole continent, I'd like to make something similar to Open Street Maps where it has height data in the images.
  152. A[20:44:02] Lou Netizen: Wouldn't you want the current state/user changed for that?
  153. A[20:44:04] Chaser Zaks: It'd also include roads and railways and points of interest.
  154. A[20:44:43] Chaser Zaks: While it would be nice to keep a live updated one, people change terrain a lot so it would quickly become outdated, so I figured the best version would be the original version.
  155. A[20:44:44] Oz Linden: No, I don't think we can do that
  156. A[20:45:49] Qie Niangao: I kinda think the roads and rails aren't baked back into the RAW files, or at least not consistently... so live terrain may be the best available
  157. A[20:46:00] Jenna Felton: I once wanted to get a heightmap of a region and was thinking about to use llGround every 4 meters and create image from the outout
  158. A[20:46:11] Jenna Felton: output
  159. A[20:46:21] animats Resident: Oh, you wanted to have the viewer show that for distant regions?
  160. A[20:46:49] Chaser Zaks: Road data isn't in the heightmaps, I'd have to manually place those. I'll just make a quick map that shows water/terrain type/roads tho, it'll be simple enough but get the info across.
  161. A[20:47:24] Oz Linden: what do want the height data for?
  162. A[20:48:02] animats Resident: Paint the SL map on a huge low-rez mesh of the height data and use that for distant regions.
  163. A[20:48:09] Lou Netizen: That's been done
  164. A[20:48:20] Lucia Nightfire: who's done it?
  165. A[20:48:25] Chaser Zaks: To make a map like this https://snapshots.softhyena.com/25088552331a960d18eda0b51ce3b0af.jpg
  166. A[20:48:45] Lou Netizen: mx.xaris. His focus was on mapping navigable waterways, but height data is height data
  167. A[20:49:11] Lou Netizen: I don't know that he's still doing it, or where the data is
  168. A[20:49:18] animats Resident: You need height data so that it looks right when seen obliquely.
  169. A[20:49:21] Lucia Nightfire: I mean emulate google street view along the roads
  170. A[20:49:47] animats Resident: More like Google Earth.
  171. A[20:50:03] Lucia Nightfire: not talking abotu google earth
  172. A[20:50:07] Lou Netizen: But hey, you could do it with bots and a streaming viewer ;)
  173. A[20:50:11] Lucia Nightfire: but that is another format that can be done
  174. A[20:50:30] Simon Linden: I can't think of a reasonable way to get what you want. Your viewer gets the terrain map, but I don't know how you could detect and determine what is a road since there's no standard for that
  175. A[20:50:35] Lucia Nightfire: I'm sure LL would prefer peopel just make accounts, log in and visit places without need of such things though
  176. A[20:50:45] Lou Netizen: very likely
  177. A[20:51:01] Lou Netizen: Low-priority unrelated question: is there anywhere I could look for up-to-date general info on the "grey goo" fence? I've looked in the wiki but have struck out. I have a new client with some odd rezzing needs. I don't think their project will even get close, but I'd like to check first.
  178. A[20:51:38] Chaser Zaks: Mapping the roads would be done the same way as they are in google maps, painfully slow.
  179. A[20:51:41] Simon Linden: I dont think we've released info on that
  180. A[20:51:56] Jenna Felton: make such a scanning bot and disguist it as a firestorm viewer for windows :)
  181. A[20:51:57] Lou Netizen: OK. I remember some general guidelines from ages ago, but that's all.
  182. A[20:52:04] Simon Linden: but if you're doing something and worried that it's too much, it probably is :)
  183. A[20:52:30] Lou Netizen: I don't *think* it'll be a problem, I just thought I'd try to check before I submit a spec.
  184. A[20:53:08] Nalates Urriah: Run tests
  185. A[20:53:10] Lou Netizen: not a big deal, in any case: I'm sure if we encounter an issue I can explain it
  186. A[20:53:23] Lou Netizen: yep! That's what I'll do. ;)
  187. A[20:54:41] Oz Linden: let us know if your tests turn up anything interesting ...
  188. A[20:55:10] Lou Netizen: will do. My sense is that this will be well below any thresholds. I
  189. A[20:56:51] Lou Netizen: /me wishes she could type anything tonight without an error
  190. A[20:57:29] Lucia Nightfire: well, I got things to do, ttyal
  191. A[20:57:57] animats Resident: Bye.
  192. A[20:58:19] Whirly Fizzle: Governance user group is about to start: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Governance_User_Group
  193. A[20:58:42] Simon Linden: I have another meeting at 1 as well ... thank you everyone for coming this week and the good chat
  194. A[20:58:52] Whirly Fizzle: Thanks Lindens
  195. A[20:58:54] Rider Linden: I should run myself.
  196. A[20:58:56] Simon Linden: See you all next time - TP safely home!
  197. A[20:58:58] Rider Linden: Thank you everyone.
  198. A[20:59:02] animats Resident: Bye all.
  199. A[20:59:02] Lou Netizen: thank you for having us
  200. A[20:59:03] Qie Niangao: Thanks Simon, Oz, Mazidox, Rider... everybody... have fun!
  201. A[20:59:04] Beq Janus: thanks all
  202. T[20:59:18] Moved: <211.02940, 47.04704, 32.96009>{Denby}
  203. A[21:00:55] Lou Netizen: /me waves
  204. A[21:10:48] Jenna Felton: sorry, was afk
  205. A[21:11:08] Jenna Felton: have a good week time Rex and all who is reading :)
  206. A[21:11:15] Jenna Felton: see you later
  207. A[21:11:18] Rex Cronon: u 2
  208. A[21:11:20] Rex Cronon: tc:)
  209. A[23:00:55] Nalates Urriah: Hi
  210. A[23:01:43] Caleb Linden: hiya
  211. A[23:02:04] Rex Cronon: hi caleb
  212. A[23:02:09] Rex Cronon: hi nal
  213. A[23:02:54] Nalates Urriah: Hi Rex
  214. A[23:03:36] Caleb Linden: small crowd today
  215. A[23:04:04] Rex Cronon: so many people here. u must be announcing some new shineies:)
  216. A[23:04:31] Caleb Linden: Animesh is now official
  217. A[23:05:10] Rex Cronon: too bad u can't us lsl to create dynamical anims:(
  218. A[23:06:05] Caleb Linden: are you guys dabbling in it a bit? animesh i mean
  219. A[23:07:07] Rex Cronon: i would like to do that. i haven't had the time yet:(
  220. A[23:07:41] Caleb Linden: i'll give it few more minutes and i let you know what's up
  221. A[23:07:54] Nalates Urriah: I'm making clothes. So, haven't gotten to Animesh
  222. A[23:08:18] Caleb Linden: next week is thanksgiving, so we are taking a break from releasing RC
  223. A[23:08:21] Rex Cronon: u could make animesh clothes:)
  224. A[23:08:39] Nalates Urriah: ? ... that do what?
  225. A[23:09:00] Rex Cronon: u could have dancing pajamas:)
  226. A[23:09:01] Caleb Linden: i can imagine the clothes that can expand
  227. A[23:09:20] Caleb Linden: and have you floating
  228. A[23:09:57] Caleb Linden: alright, let me get this out real quick and shall ajourn if the prof doesn't come :)
  229. A[23:10:08] Nalates Urriah: Animesh is not going to conform to shape. So, using animesh for clothes pushes us back to Std. Sizes. Not a good thing.
  230. A[23:10:11] Rex Cronon: would be funny to have dancing underwear:)
  231. A[23:10:18] Nalates Urriah: k
  232. A[23:10:34] Caleb Linden: that's exactly the humor toddlers can appreciate
  233. A[23:10:38] Caleb Linden: dancing underwear
  234. A[23:10:59] Rex Cronon: lol
  235. A[23:11:16] Caleb Linden: earlier this week we release bakes service update on agni
  236. A[23:11:28] Rex Cronon: they waltz:)
  237. A[23:11:48] Caleb Linden: you have have noticed some grey skin at first, but it's been running ok since then
  238. A[23:12:27] Caleb Linden: let us know if there is anything funny with textures that you haven't noticed before and we should get on it
  239. A[23:13:33] Rex Cronon: ok. i keep a lookout for funny textures:)
  240. A[23:14:07] Nalates Urriah: I'll let designers I use know there is a change. But, Until I see what Maitreya and Slink do... I probably won't do much with BoM
  241. A[23:14:49] Caleb Linden: In the mean time we have been chugging along the simulator OS upgrade on aditi. let me check if there are common regions on aditi running it already
  242. A[23:15:42] Caleb Linden: the channel name is DRTSIM-388 and we already put it out on 15 regions
  243. A[23:16:03] Caleb Linden: among them are Mesh Sandbox 1
    , Mesh Sandbox 2 and Sandbox Wanderton
  244. A[23:16:20] Rex Cronon: so, is this os upgrade like 80% done?
  245. A[23:16:56] Caleb Linden: we are crossing ts and dotting i's still
  246. A[23:17:19] Nalates Urriah: Some of the FS people were looknig for a region without the UDP inventory support for viewer testing.
  247. A[23:19:08] Caleb Linden: let me see if i can find the answer
  248. A[23:19:46] Rex Cronon: why don't you guys have like web page portal with links to all sims on beta and what os version they support. a dynamic one?
  249. A[23:21:23] Caleb Linden: I think there is one, but it wasn't maintained well
  250. A[23:22:01] Rex Cronon: it would be usefull even for lindens:)
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